Law in Contemporary Society

View   r20  >  r19  >  r18  >  r17  >  r16  >  r15  ...
GoodLeads 20 - 13 Mar 2009 - Main.MolissaFarber
Line: 1 to 1
 
META TOPICPARENT name="WebPreferences"
Got any leads on how to be a good lawyer? Put them here.
Line: 136 to 136
 -- KeithEdelman - 09 Mar 2009
Added:
>
>

Other

I came across a link today through Above the Law and thought it was relevant to this discussion. It's to a blog article called Create A New Career Outside The Law. While I think this was meant for those who don't want to practice law, it also could apply to those of us trying to figure out how to make an impact and pursue happiness as lawyers.

My big fear for my future is taking a big law job to pay off my loans and getting shackled by golden handcuffs. The author addresses the financial issue, which resonated with me:

How Do I Leave Behind My Big Paycheck?

Financial considerations always arise when transitioning out of the law. Remember, though, that it may not be the case that moving into another career will mean a pay cut. A substantial number of non-legal positions pay very acceptable salaries.[5] And if a position you decide to seek does pay less initially, it may offer the potential for you to earn more as you progress. Sometimes changing careers does entail reduced earnings, prestige and control while you take the time to develop new expertise. On the other hand, your new work may build on your previous experience, and pay more than you expect. You may also be able to supplement your income with contract legal work while you are learning a new trade or building a new business, which is what I did.

Consider, too, that you may not need to make as much money as you earned as an attorney. There’s always a trade-off: your income may diminish, but your satisfaction may increase. Because you’re doing what you want to do, you’ll feel as if your life is richer and more fulfilled in ways that can more than compensate for a lower salary. Don’t let your assumptions and fears stop you from investigating what may be open to you.

-- MolissaFarber - 13 Mar 2009

 
 
<--/commentPlugin-->

GoodLeads 19 - 09 Mar 2009 - Main.KeithEdelman
Line: 1 to 1
 
META TOPICPARENT name="WebPreferences"
Got any leads on how to be a good lawyer? Put them here.
Line: 128 to 128
 What do we do with this job satisfaction research? I don't think the answer is that we all become government lawyers. The goal is to determine what it is about these types of careers that provide higher satisfaction and try to figure out how to get those features into our own careers. I think the hours requirement is one factor that relates to job satisfaction. In addition, a concern over ethics most likely plays a role. If government lawyers don't need to worry about being disbarred for purposely losing their cases (as that NYTimes article suggests), then maybe there is an explanation for why they are happier than everyone else.
Added:
>
>

Non-Profit Organizations

After doing some research for my first paper, I realized that the Innocence Project does amazing work. Working to free the falsely-accused has tremendous meaning. I can't imagine many other uses of a law license that so directly achieve justice. For me, traditional criminal defense work raises a few moral concerns (Robinson is, after all, never far from crime). But the Innocence Project, by definition, avoids some of these issues.

With respect to happiness, I would imagine workers are far more content than at many other places. There is likely little competition against your fellow employees. Instead, workers are joined by a common, justice-driven goal. This is just one non-profit organization that surely needs young attorneys to help better the world. Any other ideas?

-- KeithEdelman - 09 Mar 2009

 
 
<--/commentPlugin-->
\ No newline at end of file

GoodLeads 18 - 06 Mar 2009 - Main.LaurenRosenberg
Line: 1 to 1
 
META TOPICPARENT name="WebPreferences"
Got any leads on how to be a good lawyer? Put them here.
Line: 124 to 124
 -- GregJohnson - 05 Mar 2009
Added:
>
>
I agree that the survey used by Dr. Monahan definitely allows for the possibility of rationalizing behavior, but the use of this standard survey over lots of individuals allows comparisons of the data between lawyers and everyone else as well as comparisons between groups of lawyers. I really wish that Dr. Monahan had measured job satisfaction over time (as opposed to a one-time survey at 20 years after law school). If these satisfaction surveys were administered longitudinally, then we could compare the results of this study with the previous studies showing high dissatisfaction in lawyers. My understanding of prior studies, including most of those included in the meta-study, is that they were generally administered with much younger lawyers, so it is conceivable that lawyers are very unhappy as new lawyers and then they become happier later in life. In addition, the fact that Dr. Monahan studied individuals in their 40s may be a reflection of a different type of work culture than the one our generation will experience. This is consistent with the finding in the meta-study that job satisfaction in lawyers has declined over time. Since these lawyers were considerably older, then they may reflect a much higher job satisfaction than we will experience.

What do we do with this job satisfaction research? I don't think the answer is that we all become government lawyers. The goal is to determine what it is about these types of careers that provide higher satisfaction and try to figure out how to get those features into our own careers. I think the hours requirement is one factor that relates to job satisfaction. In addition, a concern over ethics most likely plays a role. If government lawyers don't need to worry about being disbarred for purposely losing their cases (as that NYTimes article suggests), then maybe there is an explanation for why they are happier than everyone else.

 
 
<--/commentPlugin-->
\ No newline at end of file

GoodLeads 17 - 05 Mar 2009 - Main.KeithEdelman
Line: 1 to 1
 
META TOPICPARENT name="WebPreferences"
Got any leads on how to be a good lawyer? Put them here.
Line: 12 to 12
 I do think that working without a fear of clients correlates with having (or being able to choose) worthy clients. Still, I believe being a "good lawyer" is slightly different. A proper atmosphere certainly facilitates a happier lifestyle. But this might be a different goal. (This thread discusses the distinction between a "meaningful" and "happy" life, analogous to my distinction of being a "good lawyer" and working in a "positive atmosphere.")

-- KeithEdelman - 25 Feb 2009

Changed:
<
<

>
>
 I would say that a culture of fear makes the work less good. Because what are the lawyers afraid of? Lack of promotion? Lack of job security? Being yelled at by the boss, or the client? If you have a lawyer who's primarily focused on avoiding that, I think s/he'd do a bad job. I would want a lawyer who isn't too scared to exercise independent judgment, if I needed a lawyer. I appreciate the distinction between "good lawyer" and "positive atmosphere," but I would guess there's a correlation.

Something else we might want to consider is the ability to choose your clients, which people are discussing in the "Is Being a Corporate Lawyer Immoral?" thread. Robinson prides himself on choosing his clients. How important is that? Is there any organization you can really trust to choose your clients for you, and be willing to surrender your autonomy to? Is a boutique law firm more trustworthy than a big one? (Maybe. I don't know.)

-- AnjaliBhat - 26 Feb 2009

Added:
>
>
If by "good" you mean "effective", then I agree a culture of fear would cause him/her to do a "bad" (ineffective) job. The "good" I used above refers to the object of a lawyer's work, not his/her skill. In other words, I was referring to doing "good" in the world, not doing "well" at your job. With your definition, I agree that a poor atmosphere likely causes ineffective work. With mine, I'm not sure a harsh and overly-critical boss at the NAACP Legal Defense Fund would diminish the value of achieving racial equality.
 
Added:
>
>
Perhaps the distinction I made does not produce many new ideas, but we should at least keep the difference in mind when posting career options.
 
Changed:
<
<
>
>
-- KeithEdelman - 05 Mar 2009
 

M&A


GoodLeads 16 - 05 Mar 2009 - Main.GregJohnson
Line: 1 to 1
 
META TOPICPARENT name="WebPreferences"
Got any leads on how to be a good lawyer? Put them here.
Line: 104 to 104
 Molissa, that's probably true. I've heard things about the culture of prosecutor's offices, at least in big cities, that are not unlike large law firms. However, there's a sense of righteousness that prosecutors seem to have, of being on a mission, that may contribute to their job satisfaction. But that can create a different problem if the righteousness becomes self-righteousness.

-- AnjaliBhat - 05 Mar 2009

Added:
>
>

About John Monahan's forthcoming study ("Lawyers at Mid-Career: A 20-Year Longitudinal Study of Job and Life Satisfaction"):

I think what Anjali referred to as "all the standard problems of getting people to self-report on their own happiness" may be that expressions of overall happiness are not quite the same as overall happiness. [Oops! I see Anjali also replied while I was writing this.] As Prof. Monahan said, ideally he would have done something like the classic Csikszentmihalyi studies, where participants wore beepers and were asked at random moments throughout the day to record their momentary state of mind. This lessens reporting bias ("Look at my life! I ought to be happy overall. So I guess I am."): people are more willing to say "I'm frustrated right now" on many occasions than to say "I'm usually not satisfied."

As Lauren points out, the forthcoming study has an extremely high response rate compared to earlier studies. Among these earlier studies was one that found that 11% of North Carolina attorneys considered suicide at least once a month every month for the last year. (This and other studies were summarized in a famous 1999 meta-study, Schiltz, P., On Being A Happy, Healthy, and Ethical Member Of an Unhappy, Unhealthy, and Unethical Profession, 52 Vand. L. Rev. 871.)

The new study strongly suggests that lawyers do not report less happiness than others (earlier studies had suggested that lawyers do report much less happiness), that government lawyers report the most happiness, and that big-firm lawyers (even after 15 years, when most people who discover that big firms are not for them have long left) report a statistically-significant lower happiness (but are still quite happy).

-- GregJohnson - 05 Mar 2009

On the topic of having autonomy as a junior government lawyer: An anecdote in yesterday's Times describes a prosecutor who tried to lose a case he didn't believe had merit (rather than, say, resign or openly abandon the government's position). He argued that his client was the people and that they "would have been ill served had two innocent men remained in jail for a crime they did not commit." He's been notified that he won't be disbarred.

-- GregJohnson - 05 Mar 2009

 
 
<--/commentPlugin-->
\ No newline at end of file

Revision 20r20 - 13 Mar 2009 - 18:04:36 - MolissaFarber
Revision 19r19 - 09 Mar 2009 - 22:56:14 - KeithEdelman
Revision 18r18 - 06 Mar 2009 - 04:49:04 - LaurenRosenberg
Revision 17r17 - 05 Mar 2009 - 22:54:03 - KeithEdelman
Revision 16r16 - 05 Mar 2009 - 17:44:40 - GregJohnson
Revision 15r15 - 05 Mar 2009 - 16:43:51 - AnjaliBhat
This site is powered by the TWiki collaboration platform.
All material on this collaboration platform is the property of the contributing authors.
All material marked as authored by Eben Moglen is available under the license terms CC-BY-SA version 4.
Syndicate this site RSSATOM