Law in the Internet Society

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GraspingtheNet 16 - 28 Oct 2011 - Main.AlexeySokolin
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E Pluribus Unum

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An example of actually paying with your attention: http://socialcommercetoday.com/pay-with-a-tweet-pay-with-a-like-new-social-payments-platforms/

-- AlexeySokolin - 28 Oct 2011

 
 
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GraspingtheNet 15 - 15 Sep 2011 - Main.IanSullivan
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 Edward Rothstein, Victoria's Secret, A Sex Metaphor, New York Times, February 5, 1999
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Alice McInnes, The Agency of The InfoZone: Exploring the Effects of a Community Network, First Monday, February 1997
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Alice McInnes, The Agency of The InfoZone: Exploring the Effects of a Community Network, First Monday, February 1997
 
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Angela Lewis, Hoax E-mails and Bonsai Kittens: Are You E-literate in the Docuverse?, First Monday, August 2002
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Angela Lewis, Hoax E-mails and Bonsai Kittens: Are You E-literate in the Docuverse?, First Monday, August 2002
 John Schwartz, Professors Vie With Web for Class's Attention, New York Times, January 2, 2003
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Having a Theory

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Michael H. Goldhaber, The Attention Economy: The Natural Economy of the Net, First Monday, April 1997
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Michael H. Goldhaber, The Attention Economy: The Natural Economy of the Net, First Monday, April 1997
 
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Rishab Aiyer Ghosh, Economics is dead. Long live economics!, First Monday, May 1997
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Rishab Aiyer Ghosh, Economics is dead. Long live economics!, First Monday, May 1997
 
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Philippe Aigrain, Attention, Media, Value and Economics, First Monday, September 1997
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Philippe Aigrain, Attention, Media, Value and Economics, First Monday, September 1997
 
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Rishab Aiyer Ghosh, Cooking Pot Markets: An Economic Model for the Trade in Free Goods and Services on the Internet, First Monday, March 1998
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Rishab Aiyer Ghosh, Cooking Pot Markets: An Economic Model for the Trade in Free Goods and Services on the Internet, First Monday, March 1998
 
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Terrence A. Maxwell, Is Copyright Necessary?, First Monday, September 2004.
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Terrence A. Maxwell, Is Copyright Necessary?, First Monday, September 2004.
 Ron Lieber, American Express Kept a (Very) Watchful Eye on Charges, New York Times, January 2009

GraspingtheNet 14 - 24 Sep 2009 - Main.EbenMoglen
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I just read the article about "cooking-pot" markets, which happened to comment on my "altruism" critique (last paragraph), so I will go ahead and provide a block quote, followed by a response:

"The workings of this system of trade stem from the same motivation of "fun" present when Colin Needham developed the Internet Movies Database - which, built upon newsgroup discussions, is half-dynamic. It is Needham's need to "put back" into the Net after having "taken out" so much that drives most trade in dynamic resources. It is the cooking-pot market of a seemingly altruistic value-in-giving norm that drives the economy of interacting people.

If it occured in brickspace, my cooking-pot model would require fairly altruistic participants. A real tribal communal cooking-pot works on a pretty different model, of barter and division of labour (I provide the chicken, you the goat, she the berries, together we share the spiced stew). In our hypothetical tribe, however, people give what they have into the pot with no guarantee that they're getting a fair exchange, which smacks of altruism.

But on the Net, a cooking-pot market is far from altruistic, or it wouldn't work. This is thanks to the major cause for the erosion of value on the Internet - the problem of infinity [21]. Because it takes as much effort to distribute one copy of an original creation as a million - and because the costs are distributed across millions of people - you never lose from letting your product free in the cooking-pot, as long as you are compensated for its creation. You are not giving away something for nothing. You are giving away a million copies of something, for at least one copy of at least one other thing. Since those millions cost you nothing you lose nothing. Nor need there be a notional loss of potential earnings, because those million copies are not inherently valuable - the very fact of them being a million, and theoretically a billion or more - makes them worthless. Your effort is limited to creating one - the original - copy of your product. You are happy to receive something of value in exchange for that one creation."

Response:

The concept of altruism as it is used in the quote above is too narrow. What the author believes is not a prerequisite of participation in the cooking-pot is better described as "economic altruism," where economic loss "from letting your product free in the cooking-pot" does not inhibit the creator. Even if the creator/participant receives some alternative form of value, thus getting rid of the "altruism" requirement, there are a variety of other self-serving motivations that might inhibit a participant from letting his creation go free and multiply in the pot. Some people are inherently protective of their creations for a variety of reasons that to some may appear irrational. To overcome such a variety of "irrational" or narcissistic barriers would require altruism at much higher levels of social and emotional sophistication, far beyond the economic altruism that the author describes. Reputation, or "fun," as the author mentions, might not ever enter one's mental calculus.

-- JonathanBoyer - 24 Sep 2009

 
 
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GraspingtheNet 13 - 24 Sep 2009 - Main.JonathanBoyer
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I just read the article about "cooking-pot" markets, which happened to comment on my "altruism" critique, so I will go ahead and provide a block quote, followed by a response:
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I just read the article about "cooking-pot" markets, which happened to comment on my "altruism" critique (last paragraph), so I will go ahead and provide a block quote, followed by a response:
 "The workings of this system of trade stem from the same motivation of "fun" present when Colin Needham developed the Internet Movies Database - which, built upon newsgroup discussions, is half-dynamic. It is Needham's need to "put back" into the Net after having "taken out" so much that drives most trade in dynamic resources. It is the cooking-pot market of a seemingly altruistic value-in-giving norm that drives the economy of interacting people.

GraspingtheNet 12 - 24 Sep 2009 - Main.JonathanBoyer
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 Ron Lieber, American Express Kept a (Very) Watchful Eye on Charges, New York Times, January 2009
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The Onion News Network, Google Opt Out Feature, September 2009
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I just read the article about "cooking-pot" markets, which happened to comment on my "altruism" critique, so I will go ahead and provide a block quote, followed by a response:
 
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"The workings of this system of trade stem from the same motivation of "fun" present when Colin Needham developed the Internet Movies Database - which, built upon newsgroup discussions, is half-dynamic. It is Needham's need to "put back" into the Net after having "taken out" so much that drives most trade in dynamic resources. It is the cooking-pot market of a seemingly altruistic value-in-giving norm that drives the economy of interacting people.
 
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Since this course is about the “end of the world,” I thought a bit of humor (The Onion) would be appropriate here –- to break the ice. Although humor can function in many different ways (e.g. by increasing or decreasing the psychological distances between people in groups), I hope its use as a defense mechanism in this case is mature in the sense that it might facilitate group discussion by easing tension. See generally, http://www.ehow.com/how_2294835_use-humor-as-defense-mechanism.html
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If it occured in brickspace, my cooking-pot model would require fairly altruistic participants. A real tribal communal cooking-pot works on a pretty different model, of barter and division of labour (I provide the chicken, you the goat, she the berries, together we share the spiced stew). In our hypothetical tribe, however, people give what they have into the pot with no guarantee that they're getting a fair exchange, which smacks of altruism.
 
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A few initial impressions from class:
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But on the Net, a cooking-pot market is far from altruistic, or it wouldn't work. This is thanks to the major cause for the erosion of value on the Internet - the problem of infinity [21]. Because it takes as much effort to distribute one copy of an original creation as a million - and because the costs are distributed across millions of people - you never lose from letting your product free in the cooking-pot, as long as you are compensated for its creation. You are not giving away something for nothing. You are giving away a million copies of something, for at least one copy of at least one other thing. Since those millions cost you nothing you lose nothing. Nor need there be a notional loss of potential earnings, because those million copies are not inherently valuable - the very fact of them being a million, and theoretically a billion or more - makes them worthless. Your effort is limited to creating one - the original - copy of your product. You are happy to receive something of value in exchange for that one creation."
 
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Professor Moglen’s thesis, at this early point in the course, seems to revolve around a kind of theoretical utopia of social transformation, which necessarily adds unexplored socio-psychological propositions to his argument. As of now, I am unclear as to the extent of these propositions.
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If the internet is a social condition of interconnection, and if we presume for the sake of argument that the ideal condition is one that is absent of any controlling intermediary, what then is an accurate description of the resulting social transformation that evolves over time? Is there a social end-product? How long might it take until that product is ripe, and why is that product desirable?
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The concept of altruism as it is used in the quote above is too narrow. What the author believes is not a prerequisite of participation in the cooking-pot is better described as "economic altruism," where economic loss "from letting your product free in the cooking-pot" does not inhibit the creator. Even if the creator/participant receives some alternative form of value, thus getting rid of the "altruism" requirement, there are a variety of other self-serving motivations that might inhibit a participant from letting his creation go free and multiply in the pot. Some people are inherently protective of their creations for a variety of reasons that to some may appear irrational. To overcome such a variety of "irrational" or narcissistic barriers would require altruism at much higher levels of social and emotional sophistication, far beyond the economic altruism that the author describes. Reputation, or "fun," as the author mentions, might not ever enter one's mental calculus.
 
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Presumably, public networks (that do not currently exist) would house this ideal social condition of interconnection. Software and content that were once proprietary would now be shared, and citizens would be able to learn from each other in relatively unimpeded network space.
 
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Although the following thought is not yet fully formed, I would wager that a general deficiency of altruism throughout humankind is the greatest threat to Moglen’s utopia. Ultimately, human beings have a range of both individual and social desires, and happiness is derived from the satisfaction of these desires. Given the previous sentence, one might be inclined to debate the contours of human nature at this point -- a worthwhile debate -- but it is difficult to argue with the concept of a roughly stable normal curve that governs the variance of nearly all human traits. If the median of an altruism-narcissism normal curve is too narcissistic, Moglen’s utopia of public networks and unimpeded social transformation may never survive the democratic process. For some, if not most, I imagine it just feels really, really good to design a software program (or a 3rd grade curriculum plan for that matter) and then experience the self-derived “honor” that accompanies ownership and profits.
 
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-- JonathanBoyer - 23 Sep 2009
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-- JonathanBoyer - 24 Sep 2009
 
 
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Revision 16r16 - 28 Oct 2011 - 14:06:41 - AlexeySokolin
Revision 15r15 - 15 Sep 2011 - 18:51:56 - IanSullivan
Revision 14r14 - 24 Sep 2009 - 20:03:53 - EbenMoglen
Revision 13r13 - 24 Sep 2009 - 03:27:35 - JonathanBoyer
Revision 12r12 - 24 Sep 2009 - 01:46:59 - JonathanBoyer
Revision 11r11 - 23 Sep 2009 - 23:08:00 - JonathanBoyer
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